ToyDemon Forum
ToyDemon Lounge => Lounge Room => Topic started by: DaaaBears on December 17, 2012, 08:24:52 AM
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After the latest shooting just last friday in the elementary school, how does everyone feel about gun regulations now?
For me, I didn't really care before as I thought that these people were psychos and these incidents will always happen here and there. However, now I have changed my thought on guns now.
We should make it as hard as possible to get so that not anyone can just freaking walk into a walmart and come out with a gun or something. (Don't own a gun, but I read that some states it is as simple as that).
Enough is enough, constitution and tradition should not be the only thing we are holding on to as the right to bear arms. We used to have slaves and shit too. It has to stop!
My heart goes out to all the victims and their families. After seeing the pictures of those kids, it really breaks my heart.......
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Now, I'm not for guns.. I'm also not against guns. If you want to own a firearm for hunting or personal protection, that's fine by me, though I most likely will never own one myself. What I have a problem with is the types of guns and what is required to obtain those guns.
While it is illegal to buy an automatic weapon, it is not illegal to buy an automatic weapon conversion kit. Granted you can't buy the kit and the gun in the same transaction, but there are so many work-arounds for this it's ridiculous. I see no reason for a person to (legally) own an automatic or even semi-automatic weapon. If you want to fire an auto or semi-auto or some of the larger caliber weapons, they should be owned and kept by gun ranges, not to leave there and on a sign in/sign out system*.
The other point is regulations. There are more regulations for buying a car than there are for buying guns in a lot of places. Criminal background checks are a good start, but seriously there should be some sort of psych evaluation along with it. There are lots of people out there with no record that have pretty serious mental health issues. Hell, earlier this year I went to work at a local nuclear power plant. There are people I work with that have some pretty extensive criminal pasts, and own many guns legally and the plant wouldn't let them in the front door. Hell, in all honesty I don't have a record but almost failed the psych evaluation because of depression issues, yet, I could probably walk into the gun shop in tears and be approved for a handgun and one singular bullet*.
The "second amendment supporters" hide behind the literal word of the law rather than interpreting it for what it's supposed to be.. keeping the King of England out of your face. Now, like I said, if you want to own a gun for hunting or protection that's fine.. but do you really need 12 different types of firearm to kill a deer?
All of that being said, the surest way to make people want a lot of something, is to make it illegal. Outlawing guns is definitely not the answer. I also realize that no matter what if someone wants something bad enough they're going to get it. So there will still be automatic weapons and ridiculously large caliber handguns and rifles out there, but if the regs were stricter there would be a lot less of them and sociopathic Johnny over there with no criminal record won't have that AK-47 when he finally snaps.
Incidents like this happen, have always happened, and will always happen. It's extremely sad but there is nothing anyone can do to prevent this sort of thing from ever happening again. Although, in my (admittedly unreliable) memory, more things like this took place in this country in the past five years than in the past 20. That could be just because of the information age and we're hearing about them now, or they just could be happening more. If you tighten the belt, though, maybe things like this wouldn't happen so often, or at the very least wouldn't be as severe.
If all the gun nuts (not everyone who owns a gun, just the people who are nuts for their guns) want to revolt over stricter laws, let them. If they want to leave the country, even better.
*Disclaimer: I really don't know how gun ranges work or the process for purchasing a firearm, if what I said up there was total BS or not even close please excuse my ignorance.
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Something I had never been able to understand about this country is that fascination with guns. The Second Amendment establishes the right to have arms (weapons) - it does not specify which type of weapon or the quantities.
States and territories can and MUST establish controls on the type and quantities of weapons available for civilian use. Personally, I believe that civilians should not be allowed any fire arm with a capacity of more than 10 bullets before reloading. If you want a weapon for personal defense, you should not need more than that to protect you or your family (at least in current society). BTW, why no one limits the quantity of weapons to whatever you can use at a time - ie 2 handguns or 1 rifle? Do you really need 7 rifles? Or 45?
Also, I believe in the control of ammunition. In the last attacks, the psychos had hundreds and even thousands of rounds. Bullets are too cheap - a 9mm bullet costs just 25 cents - and people can buy hundreds through different vendors before any "red flag" is raised. It is stupid that in some states you have more restrictions to vote than to buy a high power rifle or ammo for one.
Don't get me wrong - I used to have guns (Magnum .357 and a 38) until I moved to the States. I had them for personal protection purposes and I sold them to a shooting range and registered the sale as required by law. Currently I don't own any weapon because frankly I don't need any...
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Another terrible incident indeed. However, sorry for getting into the cliché book, but guns are only as dangerous as the person using them. I read Morgan Freeman's take on the shooting yesterday and he's absolutely right, the real problem here is the media.
"It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed
people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next."
So my point is, you can take away guys, sure. But if the media continues to portray these events like a Friday the 13th movie, the next psychopath is going to think about gas bombs, anthrax, and god knows what other awful things are out there. If we want to fix this nation, fix our media, and intelligently filter information.
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I agree with gilbot...very true indeed...media these days are all messed up ...you turn on the tv and all you hear is all the bad news and almost nothing good.... worthless things..sigh..
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All I know is that this nonsense has only SPIKED the gun market. The AR15 has never been more popular and is mostly sold out or on back order. Prices for them online are crazy. I was planning to buy an AR later this year but now I have to go and try to get one before the ban and on top of that have to pay more. Some of these guns are now almost $1,000 more thanks to that POS Lanza and even worse the idiotic PC public thinking a gun ban will keep events like this from occurring and politicians trying to please the dimwit public. Guns have nothing to do with this it's the people behind them. A gun law isn't going to stop a maniac from killing people. If some nut job wants to kill people they are going to do it regardless. It's not hard to make a bomb or some kind of weapon capable of killing people. It's just that those of us who are in sane mental health choose not to do things like that. The new laws restrict the magazine capacity,stocks, and some other nonsense. That's not going to stop anyone from using an AR. The parts and all the pieces are still out there. It only makes it harder for NEW buyers to purchase a semi automatic weapon that's "comfortable".
I would also be all for the "Gun law" if it meant something but it doesn't. People that use guns for unlawful purposes don't use registered weapons to begin with so they're not worried about a gun laws. Those arms are straight off the black market where regulations do not apply only money. Not to mention most gun related crimes in the US are done by HANDGUNS not AR-15's. You're not going to stuff an M4 Carbine into your glove box or the waste band of your pants. I'd feel safer knowing they were going to crack down on Hand guns regulations but we all know this law is basically aiming at the AR-15. A weapon that isn't exactly at the top of the list when it comes to gun related crime in America.
It's mostly a poor solution to an unrelated problem. Guns aren't whats implanting the "idea" that it's okay to go and shoot up a bunch of people because you'll be idolized... It's the Media doing that. They idolized all of these killers and glorified what they did by talking about it constantly,publishing their pictures on the cover of Time magazine, making movies about them, etc. etc. If that's not "glorifying" their deeds than I don't know what is because if you weren't capable of telling what they did was wrong you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between Columbine and the Superbowl the way the media highlights these events. They should put a Media Ban or Restriction on reporting this kind of news because all it does is just infect one nut job to the next giving them ideas. Lanza might have been "successful" by being able to pull off the despicable act he did but lets not forgot the many other Gunmen throughout the course of the year that tried to follow after James Holmes by shooting random people in public places. They just didn't have a high "body count" or the crime wasn't atrocious enough for them to get "super star coverage" the media awards the assholes with but these events still happened and the media had a stronger influence in their actions than the rifles they carried did.
That's just my 2cents.
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I somewhat agree with the it's not the guns, it's the people. But that doesn't mean something shouldn't be done. I think it's a fact that guns are too widely available that's the problem. The guy who shot up the elementary school just grabbed his mom's gun didn't he? I mean gun's purpose is just to damage or kill stuff easier and faster. Those that are sick will always kill people yes, let's not make it so easy to do so. Just cuz someone think that it won't do anything to stop the mass killing doesn't meant we shouldn't try to stop it?
To be honest, right after the Colorado theater shooting. When I went to see Batman about 2 weeks after that, I heard some metal clanging and it was probably just somebody adjusting their belt buckle or something, but it was definitely on my mind and I was searching for the noise and looking for the exit doors. I don't know how to solve it, and I don't think it'd be easy to solve it, but something needs to be done for sure.
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Great discussion. Thanks for bringing it up. I agree with other posters who say that there is no reason for a private citizen to own a semi-automatic or automatic weapon. Right to bear arms, sure, but there should be a limit on the lethality. The right to defend oneself should be limited to one on one combat. The Constitution at this points provides the right for any US Citizen to defend oneself against zombie invasion.
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It would help if instead of trying to remove guns they made them harder for "certain" people to get. Just like a drivers license. You can't exactly just go and get one of those without taking courses, passing them, being approved, and then finally getting one. Guns should be the same. Some of these people out here like those NRA wacko's are complete nuts. The live their lives trapped in a military fantasy hoping and wishing someone comes on their property or breaks in their house or some apocalypse comes along just so they'll have an actual reason to use their guns for once. I sure never liked the Concealed weapons permit or even the open carry permit. No one should carry a gun in or near the public unless they are law,police,security, or military.
Knowing some yoyo that's just a civilian like me is carrying around a weapon like he's John Wayne doesn't make me feel good and never did. Most of the time these guys are just looking for an excuse to use it... just look at the Trayvon Martin Case. If an idiot like Zimmerman didn't have a gun it would have ended differently (with him learning not to suspect every random person he sees walking with groceries of being a criminal). Guns really change people by giving them a false sense of power/protection. As soon as they feel threatened the first thing they'll do is run for their gun and end up shooting a family member or relative by mistake (which happens A LOT!).
If they made it harder for just any person to get a weapon you'd have a lot less gun related incidents. Another thing why I also feel the gun ban/changes aren't going to do anything is because they don't solve any of the current problems.
Which is mostly gun related violence. What are they going to do about all these guns on the street already? Just like guns they need to make the Ammo harder to get, so even if you have a gun already it won't be that easy to go pick up ammo for it at wal-mart or the local gun store in your hood. Now that I think about it, it's probably easier to buy a gun and ammo than it is to buy a Meiki.
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http://news.yahoo.com/round-one-knockout-blow-obamas-gun-control-agenda-130305474--abc-news-politics.html;_ylt=A2KJ2Ui7dnFRTCsAzx_QtDMD
sigh.... at least we know which one of these are backed by NRA funds.... :P